History is repeating itself in many ways.
This is exactly how Toyota chose to show the Lexus LFA to the world; first, as a thinly veiled concept/race car, then as the final production car a short time after. And that’s exactly how the new generation Supra is being shown to us today, revealed only hours ago at the Geneva Motor Show.
This as exciting as it gets, but at the same time we are still left with a sense of wonder, trying to figure out by copious amounts of educated guessing what the final road car will look and feel like. As cool as a wide-body carbon fibre race car is, to people like you and me it will be the final production car that will really get our juices following.
While Toyota was a little short on actual facts and data about the race car itself, there is much that we can gauge from just looking at the series of PR images that have been released.
There’s no hiding the fact that Toyota has penned a very recognisable shape, a silhouette that in some areas even throws a few visual JZA80 cues into the mix. The long hood line to house the BMW-sourced straight-six turbo engine, merging into a well proportioned hatchback rear. It just looks modern, aggressive and well… right. There’s even an R35 GT-R-like roof and glasshouse design which combines to make it look like a junior supercar.
Squint a little and you can see some JZA80 in the front end, too.
The protruding F1-hinting nose, the Lexus-like LED projectors – the closer you look, the more you discover.
And just like me, you are probably wondering about a GR or TRD special version that will eventually have to be made. Can you feel it? That’s proper excitement brewing out of a Japanese car company. When was the last time that happened?
Looking at the stripped-out modern race car cabin, there’s very little that will link it to the finished production car. We can sort of get an idea of what the main dashboard will look like, a twin binnacle layout, one for the main dash instrumentation and the central one for the LCD infotainment/navigation screen. Judging by the edgy design of the door pulls we can expect the trim to carry a similar theme.
Much like the ZN6 (GT86/BRZ/FRS), the Supra will be a Godsend for the aftermarket, especially in the domestic market of Japan where tuners and parts manufacturers have been racking their brains trying to figure out what to modify next.
The race car runs Michelin slick-clad BBS center-lock race wheels, hiding the latest offering from Brembo’s motorsport line up. Maybe these are relationships that will span right down to the production car; BBS Japan did make the wheels for the Lexus LFA and Brembo is a popular choice for many manufacturers.
The race car sports massive fender flares and carbon fiber extractors, none of which will make the final production version.
We quite like the center-exit exhaust.
Consider this one of the best previews of an eagerly awaited car that you could possibly get. It’s also a great marketing move from the folks at Toyota and a wake up call for the rest of the Japanese manufacturers, who in comparison now seem like they’ve gone to sleep or have simply forgotten what the world wants to see from them.
Dino Dalle Carbonare
The R35 has carried on the legacy of the Nissan GTR's but just like the new NSX, I don't think the new Supra will live up to its Predecessor. As for the new Type-R it's a 50/50 imo.
Everyone hated the R35 GTR when the first protos were unveiled. People called it a face lifted G35, an insult to the Skyline family, an insult to Nissan and the whole tuner community - now look where we are today.
We have to see just how the car fairs and sells
We´ll see if this new Supra can live to the hype
keep the steering wheel exactly like that.
and hopefully mazda will re-introduce a rotor... rx9?
Why use the slant six from BMW? People are gonna be swapping 2JZs into these as soon as they comes out.
I highly doubt that due to the fact that, as Paddy mentioned above, the 2jz is a 30 year old engine. Couple that with the strict emissions and referee requirements in many countries/states, on top of the presumably high MSRP. I could see in 5-6 years after the first production year that being done, but I think the BMW I6 will prove to be reliable, just like the N54
Can't say im excited about them running a BMW motor in the new Supra. It's like the Japanese manufacturers just can't get it right these days with their sports cars. Either the performance is there and the car's aesthetics aren't or the car looks good but the performance isn't really there.
BMW turbo 6 cylinder's are the new age 2jz's, if you cant beat them join them. In-fact every manufacturer should be considering asking BMW for a motor. Power, performance, fuel efficient, proven low emissions. We need to all accept where the future is going.
Unless the new supra is going to be base model corvette money I don't know how they expect to sell an ugly miata in this market.
It might surprise you to know that people in countries that aren't the US buy cars as well....
This thing will sell well in Australia if the pricing is right. Holden don't do a performance RWD car anymore, so there is a hole in the market that this will fill perfectly.
I see no Z4 in this car, and I honestly think people are imagining it. I don't mind the BMW influence, and I quite like the styling. The problem with bringing back old name plates is that folks will always, unfairly, compare the new car to the old car. The Mk.IV achieved it's legendary status over a long, long time. It wasn't an instant classic when it came out in '93. This car undoubtedly has huge shoes to fill, but in this day and age, having a sports car chassis and engine co-developed by BMW is not bad whatsoever. Not having a manual option is blasphemy though. That's what makes or breaks this car.
Are you guys serious, Toyota is showing us what the new supra looks like and all i hear is complaining? This is sick. Showing it off in racecar form is awesome and standard for Japanese manufactures these days, and if the BMW joint venture is what it took to get a strait six turbo then so be it. Has anyone been in a 1M ? Its awesome and its a BMW strait six turbo. At least Toyota is creating new products for the younger crowd vs catering to people who want 140K GTR's. Yall need to chill out and wait for the test drives.
The new Z4 looks like shit next to this. I love nearly everything about the supra's looks... apart from the little beak thing
Very Nice,about time ! ... Someone has put the fronts brake discs/rotors, around the wrong way, btw, note Grooves directions
I agree with the last statement a lot,its like the car manufacturers have become zombies and making updated versions of what they have, Toyota being the one person to wake up and step out of line and take the fresh path, un-carved, virgin to takers of the path, like a road you've never seen on a mountain pass, taking it slow for the first time, then the 2nd, flooring it through the corners and, being skilled enough, take the corners head on, hitting the apex's and never once crashing, that's the new route Toyota is taking, lets hope they don't crash it
Please change the back of the car and put little like the old rear lights with new design.
I can't find any reason to complain about this car, really, maybe the automatic transmission, probably the hybrid, but the fact that this car is so close to a bmw z4 almost make me hope that the final price could be something way more cheap than the 100k $ I was expecting. I mean this could actually be a car that in 10/15 years normal people like me could buy. It doesn't sound so bad to me, even if it's not the 3jz 100% jdm car everyone's wet dreams was all about.
THE SUPRA IS COMING!!!!! YEESS!!!!
The Mark VI is out!
This looks good, but I just can't get past the fact that it still looks like a z4 with a bodykit. The gt86/brz was it's own car, but this looks like toyota has just modified a z4.
Still looking forward to seeing what the tuning industry cooks up though.
Dino, who designed/engineered the chassis? Was it BMW as well?
"Just make a Supra with 2JZ" HAHAHA
Where are all the R35 haters? "V6 eww, no manual eww" I don't see the R35 being a failure on the roads nor the track.
You won't buy this new Supra, so your opinions are irrelevant.
Dead on arrival. Costly well over the 30K target. Niche market toy that's not what we need. O well Toyota pretty much dead in engineering and hell bent on cost saving...
This will be huge. There is no way Toyota releases a new car with a supra badge and it's a failure.
Guaranteed, if this is an international release it will be huge. Australia is sorely missing in good RWD cars these days, with Holden going FWD for their vehicles. I really hope we get this. I just hope the government/toyota australia doesn't apply any extra 'fees' that bump the price too high.....
Wow! Toyota actually have some balls (unlike Nissan) and stuck with an inline 6 turbo... granted it is a BMW power plant. That shows even more credibility by Toyota; with BMW having taken the inline 6 further in terms of development than any other maker, shows they are not afraid to collaborate with the best (arguably) engine tech.
As much as i like the idea of a inline 6 supra in 2018 it's a let down because it is NOT a Toyota.
What's the point of calling it a supra when clearly it is not, they could have used a toyota v6 platform and use an existing gearbox design then it would be an actual toyota not some crappy bmw inspired supra crap.
Disappointing and definitely nothing to get excited about as it will be an overpriced toyota that only rich knobbys can afford!
Why is everyone bitching about the shared motor!? These companies aren't growing their own organic alloys lovingly by hand, they buy metal in bulk that will (hopefully) meet the requirements. "It's not a Toyota heart" etc. Boo hoo. You want the iconic layout, check. Developed chassis, check. Top quality engine, check. And to do it on budget (someone writing they hope a TT IL6 RWD will be under $30k lol) they need to make choices re development vs delivery. The BMW engine is one of the best production lumps around AND the aftermarket will be far more motivated if their products fit more vehicles.
I have a problem with that hole on the nose. Toyota wants to make money clearly, and that's their sole goal, and to my personal view at least, Toyota is one of those companies that has very little emtions for the enthusiast base, It's not Porsche, so that's kinda expected.
Collabration on it's own isn't a public crisis, but choosing the Z4/Z5 platform is deffinately is. What does a hairdresser little bimmer has in common with the Supra? absolutely nothing, they could have picked some other platform, with simmilar dimensions, driving manners to the Supra.
The other thing, I thing Toyota could have dropped their own forced induced V6 into this thing, and it would have worked just fine.
I don't understand all the negative comments. Is it overhyped? No. Did we overhype ourselves? Yes, definitely. The new Supra will never be the same as the MKIV Supra. In this modern time with so many restrictions, there is no way it can have a 2JZ equivalent. It has a turbo inline six, which people hate already because it's from BMW. Well, BMW engineering is perfectly fine. It's a good brand with good cars. Do people like the M4? Yes, they do. So have faith the Z4/Supra collaboration will be good as well. Engineering won't be the problem, it's the expectations everyone has. That's the only problem with this car. As soon as Toyota showed the FT1 the automotive world went nuts. We just need to calm down, wait for the reviews of both the Z4 and Supra and then talk trash. With solid arguments, facts we can back up. Or regret this negative attitude we have towards a sportscar in times where a lot of manufacturers decide to stop making fun cars for enthusiasts.
BMW engineering is not "perfectly fine."
It's fussy and fragile compared to Toyota.
Do you have specific examples to show the N54 is "fragile"?
While the basic engineering of the hard parts is sound, the German luxury brands are so hung up on being "cutting edge" that they pack their vehicles full of half-engineered parts - electronics mainly - that haven't been fully developed for mass distribution.
So BMW straight sixes use plastic water pump impellers that shed vanes with a harsh word, Mercedes have wiring harnesses that disintegrate because their insulation is biodegradable and Audis...well, just Google that picture of Richard Dean Anderson standing next to his A6 Allroad with the hood up, stranded by the side of the road.
I wouldn't want to be known for making cars that even MacGyver can't fix.
Put another way, there was this exchange from The Red Green Show:
Harold: "Oh yeah, but is it CUTTING EDGE?"
Red: "Oh yeah, you could cut yourself real bad on the one edge there..."
Toyota got me hype! I refuse to compare this to the JZA80. It's not the same car! I'm ready for it, Toyota is doing things and that's reason to be excited. They get criticized for years of making cars reliable and "boring", though that's what the market seems to want (with the exception of all of us car obsessed enthusiasts). Now they come out with an amazing concept and we trash it because it won't be a new JZA80? That's ridiculous. Let's have a think! This is exciting, give it a chance for what it is and is supposed to be, not what it isn't and never will be.
You're exactly right. So many enthusiasts spend all their time whingeing that manufacturers haven't brought out new versions of their celebrated performance cars (whether it's a Skyline, Silvia, Supra, RX-7, S2000, Civic Type-R, Integra Type-R, Ford Escort, whatever), and then when they finally do, the very same people whinge that it's not an exact replica of the old one - even if, like the Supra, each generation was quite different from the last! When a company like Nissan recognises that there is a market for a simpler kind of performance car - the 370Z - they cop a whole lot of flak for not releasing a totally new one of those every few years. You want your old-school performance thrills, where it's just you, the engine rear-wheel drive, and a full manual gearbox if you need that? There it is! Stop bitching and go buy one.
The new Supra still has an inline-6 with the same capacity as the old one, tonnes of tuning potential like the old one, there are recognisable styling cues of the old one, they've named it the JZA90 as a continuation of the old one, and it's front-engine, rear-wheel-drive - just like the old one. To top it off, if Toyota did drop their 3.5-litre twin-turbo V6 in, which would also have been great, people would be losing their shit over the fact that it's not a Toyota inline-6. This will in all likelihood be an excellent car and I'm looking forward to seeing them on the road. If it doesn't have enough power for you, modify it. If it doesn't have the right gearbox for you, modify it. If it's too heavy or the taillights look wrong or you don't like the central front vent, modify it. Isn't that what we're here for?
Seriously F%^$! Toyota. I was hoping they would get this right but NOPE..They tease us with the FT1 for a few years then basically throw its lines on a new BMW Z4 and call it a supra. This pile of crap doesnt deserve the name. What is wrong with them? They have have so much goddamn money and engineers and cant make their own clean sheet sports car like they have done before.
They just announced that the production version won’t be revealed until 2019
One of the pro-Euro rags - I think it was Road & Track - said this car looked "angry" back when it debuted.
Please - the Mark IV has the happiest-looking face of any car on the road.
Thank you Paddy. I'm surrounded by these things here in Japan. You've got beat up old garbage examples, pristine examples, purist examples, modified examples, and everything in between. They're pretty ubiquitous and about as exciting as seeing a Mustang in the US.
i see another nsx like failure approaching .for years these concepts were all over the place people lost their attention waiting because of that today some unknown sports ev cars sounds more intersting
The NSX was only a 'failure' because too many people wanted it to be sub $60kUS. It's a supercar, and has a supercar price tag.
This supra will be success. There is 0% chance that it won't be. Maybe not in the US, but to be honest, who cares what the US thinks? Hell, their manufacturers still use leaf springs in their 'performance' cars......
Ok, let's do a 2jz swap.
It's nice too see a new sportscar coming from the land of the rising sun. But you can't call it proper japanese if the heart is bmw : / That's the only thing that bothers me. And no offense at all to BMW, i know the make the most powerful and advanced engines in the world. Maybe my point of view will be a bit extreme... But with all my politeness and diplomacy, I believe the purists want a proper Toyota TRD engineered car, with a Toyota engine. Am I right or am i wrong? Up to you
The main reason I don’t like the new Supra is because all I see is a BMW with a Toyota shell and badge. I would’ve liked it if it was powered by a turbocharged V6 made by Toyota. At this point I don’t care about the performance of the car or the looks. I’m disappointed that it’s powered by a BMW I-6. I have nothing against the BMW I-6 but I don’t think it should be put in a car that Toyota made so famous. I get that co development in cars is cheaper now but to me it makes cars have less character. To me the new Supra is a disgrace to the Supra name. While it looks good and will probably have decent performance, I have lost interest because it’s mostly BMW underneath and the car isn’t worthy of the now legendary Supra name.
Looks cool, but that bmw engine worries me... modern BMW engines are terribly unreliable
i have a feeling its a z4 with a diffrent body and interrior
the body line realy looks like one and has a bmw engine from what i heard